<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><!-- generator="wordpress/2.1.2" -->
<rss version="2.0" 
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/">
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: CSS Hacks: Are They Cool or Not?</title>
	<link>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/</link>
	<description>thoughts on &#124; comments about &#124; examples of  } web design trends.</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jul 2008 11:01:01 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.1.2</generator>

	<item>
		<title>By: Andreas</title>
		<link>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50431</link>
		<author>Andreas</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 May 2007 10:59:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50431</guid>
					<description>I find using hacks (or CCs) is sometimes inevitable, but i would really like to see CCs in CSS aswell as HTML.

When working on very large websites i often have one base CSS and one for each unique page that contains styling only needed on that page (to limit filesize). It would be neat if i could put all the hacks for a page in the same file, instead of one massive IE-CSS-file with every hack for every page.

But i do agree with most people that hacks should be avoided as much as posibble.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I find using hacks (or CCs) is sometimes inevitable, but i would really like to see CCs in CSS aswell as HTML.</p>
<p>When working on very large websites i often have one base CSS and one for each unique page that contains styling only needed on that page (to limit filesize). It would be neat if i could put all the hacks for a page in the same file, instead of one massive IE-CSS-file with every hack for every page.</p>
<p>But i do agree with most people that hacks should be avoided as much as posibble.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
				</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jon Christopher</title>
		<link>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50466</link>
		<author>Jon Christopher</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 May 2007 12:37:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50466</guid>
					<description>It is my personal opinion that hacks are the wrong way to go.  What everyone is trying to work toward is solid design with sound code supporting it.  CSS hacks are not sound.  I'm sure many designers/developers spent lots of time 'fixing' client websites in preparation for the release of IE7, and I'm nearly as sure they won't want to go through that again.  Unfortunately, with hacks, you're faced with that situation with every browser release.  To me it seems like a step backward.  We all know hacks are mostly used to help out with rendering in Internet Explorer, but Microsoft gave us a perfectly good crutch in conditional comments.  Other browsers neglect them as commented data and are none the wiser.  The only browser to do anything with a conditional comment is the browser we're trying to target.  Add on control right down to browser version and we as designers/developers are good to go.  Yes there are a couple extra lines in our source, and there are also extra style sheets, but in my opinion the end result is far more stable than hacks and well worth it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is my personal opinion that hacks are the wrong way to go.  What everyone is trying to work toward is solid design with sound code supporting it.  CSS hacks are not sound.  I&#8217;m sure many designers/developers spent lots of time &#8216;fixing&#8217; client websites in preparation for the release of IE7, and I&#8217;m nearly as sure they won&#8217;t want to go through that again.  Unfortunately, with hacks, you&#8217;re faced with that situation with every browser release.  To me it seems like a step backward.  We all know hacks are mostly used to help out with rendering in Internet Explorer, but Microsoft gave us a perfectly good crutch in conditional comments.  Other browsers neglect them as commented data and are none the wiser.  The only browser to do anything with a conditional comment is the browser we&#8217;re trying to target.  Add on control right down to browser version and we as designers/developers are good to go.  Yes there are a couple extra lines in our source, and there are also extra style sheets, but in my opinion the end result is far more stable than hacks and well worth it.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
				</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Rommert</title>
		<link>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50478</link>
		<author>Rommert</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 May 2007 13:24:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50478</guid>
					<description>When I'm working on a website I try to use absolutely no CSS hacks, conditional comments for IE are the way to go.

Though, there is one hack I occasionaly resort to and that's the clearing float hack (http://www.positioniseverything.net/easyclearing.html). I could just use clearing divs but that would mean adding an extra element to the markup.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When I&#8217;m working on a website I try to use absolutely no CSS hacks, conditional comments for IE are the way to go.</p>
<p>Though, there is one hack I occasionaly resort to and that&#8217;s the clearing float hack (http://www.positioniseverything.net/easyclearing.html). I could just use clearing divs but that would mean adding an extra element to the markup.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
				</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Nate Klaiber</title>
		<link>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50489</link>
		<author>Nate Klaiber</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 May 2007 13:59:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50489</guid>
					<description>I guess I take a different stance. I would rather place the hacks in a separate stylesheet than use the Conditional Comments. Conditional Comments live in the markup. For those who don't deal with templates/included files this can take quite a while to remove them from the head. I don't even care so much that they are invalid (since they aren't seen), but it IS just another hack (only IE renders it). 

So, I would rather extract the hack to a separate css (@import, whatever you choose), than to add something extra to markup (which is still a hack).

Your best bet, as stated above, is to find out what works and use that - seek out solutions that won't require hacks in the first place. Then, when you have no where else to turn - you may have to resort to hacks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I guess I take a different stance. I would rather place the hacks in a separate stylesheet than use the Conditional Comments. Conditional Comments live in the markup. For those who don&#8217;t deal with templates/included files this can take quite a while to remove them from the head. I don&#8217;t even care so much that they are invalid (since they aren&#8217;t seen), but it IS just another hack (only IE renders it). </p>
<p>So, I would rather extract the hack to a separate css (@import, whatever you choose), than to add something extra to markup (which is still a hack).</p>
<p>Your best bet, as stated above, is to find out what works and use that - seek out solutions that won&#8217;t require hacks in the first place. Then, when you have no where else to turn - you may have to resort to hacks.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
				</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ron Scott</title>
		<link>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50500</link>
		<author>Ron Scott</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 May 2007 14:50:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50500</guid>
					<description>You make a good point, Nate. Conditional comments can be a bit of a hassle sometimes when you aren't using templates/includes, but hacks can (and will) cause grief in the future when there's even more browsers on the market, and you need to go through your CSS to fix various errors.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You make a good point, Nate. Conditional comments can be a bit of a hassle sometimes when you aren&#8217;t using templates/includes, but hacks can (and will) cause grief in the future when there&#8217;s even more browsers on the market, and you need to go through your CSS to fix various errors.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
				</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Brandon</title>
		<link>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50572</link>
		<author>Brandon</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 May 2007 18:54:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50572</guid>
					<description>To not use hacks is to deny yourself the present for the hope of the future. I am not going to allow myself to suffer simply because Microsoft was nasty 2-10 years ago. 

Hacks might not be 'cool', but me having a useful, functional, profitable site is 'cool'. So I shall remain with hacks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To not use hacks is to deny yourself the present for the hope of the future. I am not going to allow myself to suffer simply because Microsoft was nasty 2-10 years ago. </p>
<p>Hacks might not be &#8216;cool&#8217;, but me having a useful, functional, profitable site is &#8216;cool&#8217;. So I shall remain with hacks.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
				</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ted Goas</title>
		<link>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50669</link>
		<author>Ted Goas</author>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 May 2007 01:31:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50669</guid>
					<description>I agree with those who suggest using conditional comments to insert various CSS fixes for IE. But what about others instances? Though not as common, there are hacks for Safari and Opera. What about inline css hacks for IE (common in pages created from a CMS, where you don't have access to the entire resulting HTML doc.)?

While we may not be proud of using hacks, sometimes a few here or there can get projects across the finish line.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with those who suggest using conditional comments to insert various CSS fixes for IE. But what about others instances? Though not as common, there are hacks for Safari and Opera. What about inline css hacks for IE (common in pages created from a CMS, where you don&#8217;t have access to the entire resulting HTML doc.)?</p>
<p>While we may not be proud of using hacks, sometimes a few here or there can get projects across the finish line.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
				</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Darren</title>
		<link>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50771</link>
		<author>Darren</author>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 May 2007 08:25:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50771</guid>
					<description>It isn't always easy to be 'hack-free'. I'm sure we all try to avoid them but sometimes the time to correct a css problem would be far to great in the later stages of development.

I am a firm believer in condition comments. I am using asmall one on my own website currently. I still await the days when I can create a stylesheet without the hassel of different appearances, but, untill then I will resort to conditional comments and if all else fails hacks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It isn&#8217;t always easy to be &#8216;hack-free&#8217;. I&#8217;m sure we all try to avoid them but sometimes the time to correct a css problem would be far to great in the later stages of development.</p>
<p>I am a firm believer in condition comments. I am using asmall one on my own website currently. I still await the days when I can create a stylesheet without the hassel of different appearances, but, untill then I will resort to conditional comments and if all else fails hacks.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
				</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Andrew Faulkner</title>
		<link>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50814</link>
		<author>Andrew Faulkner</author>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 May 2007 11:45:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50814</guid>
					<description>I agree that it isn't always easy to be hack free.

One thing that annoys me though is when designers expect the design to look &lt;em&gt;exactly&lt;/em&gt; the same in different browsers and use hacks to achieve this. Why bother? One should be trying to get it to look great in all browsers, not identical.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree that it isn&#8217;t always easy to be hack free.</p>
<p>One thing that annoys me though is when designers expect the design to look <em>exactly</em> the same in different browsers and use hacks to achieve this. Why bother? One should be trying to get it to look great in all browsers, not identical.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
				</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ted Goas</title>
		<link>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50932</link>
		<author>Ted Goas</author>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 May 2007 20:12:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50932</guid>
					<description>Andrew, I recently worked for a shop that asked for this 'pixel-perfect' detail across every browser. We lived and died by hacks a lot of the time.

As you point out, we spent more time perfecting the details of a site rather than working on new clients and bringing in more $$$.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Andrew, I recently worked for a shop that asked for this &#8216;pixel-perfect&#8217; detail across every browser. We lived and died by hacks a lot of the time.</p>
<p>As you point out, we spent more time perfecting the details of a site rather than working on new clients and bringing in more $$$.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
				</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Rachel</title>
		<link>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50936</link>
		<author>Rachel</author>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 May 2007 20:32:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-50936</guid>
					<description>I hate hacks, but sometimes there's no alternative. I like the idea of putting hacks in a separate file so it's easy to locate them and correct them as they become obsolete...and so someone working after you can easily find them. As much as I try to make my CSS hack free, it's a hard position to take against a boss/client who is wondering why a layout looks a little "off". If a workaround exists, I'm going to have to use it.

I see conditional comments as a less-evil version of a hack. To me, it's no worse than having separate style sheets for separate browsers, and less redundant. A conditional comment is at least formally supported somehow, and less likely to break in the future; whereas a true hack is really just exploiting a bug and can cause problems down the road.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I hate hacks, but sometimes there&#8217;s no alternative. I like the idea of putting hacks in a separate file so it&#8217;s easy to locate them and correct them as they become obsolete&#8230;and so someone working after you can easily find them. As much as I try to make my CSS hack free, it&#8217;s a hard position to take against a boss/client who is wondering why a layout looks a little &#8220;off&#8221;. If a workaround exists, I&#8217;m going to have to use it.</p>
<p>I see conditional comments as a less-evil version of a hack. To me, it&#8217;s no worse than having separate style sheets for separate browsers, and less redundant. A conditional comment is at least formally supported somehow, and less likely to break in the future; whereas a true hack is really just exploiting a bug and can cause problems down the road.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
				</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Chris James</title>
		<link>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-51751</link>
		<author>Chris James</author>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Jun 2007 12:29:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-51751</guid>
					<description>I find the more and more you practice CSS the less need there is for hacks. 

I recently did a project where everything worked fine in the major non IE browsers and all i had to do was a seperate css for ie6. 

It only had 6 lines in it. 

I compared this to when I first started CSS, where there were hacks everywhere. 

I think with experience you can learn how to deal with problems without using hacks. But also more importantly you code defensively, so you dont have to resort to them at all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I find the more and more you practice CSS the less need there is for hacks. </p>
<p>I recently did a project where everything worked fine in the major non IE browsers and all i had to do was a seperate css for ie6. </p>
<p>It only had 6 lines in it. </p>
<p>I compared this to when I first started CSS, where there were hacks everywhere. </p>
<p>I think with experience you can learn how to deal with problems without using hacks. But also more importantly you code defensively, so you dont have to resort to them at all.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
				</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: YPM</title>
		<link>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-52874</link>
		<author>YPM</author>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Jun 2007 15:52:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-52874</guid>
					<description>Aslong as IE exists as worlds worst CSS programm, hacks are very usefull and cool =P</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Aslong as IE exists as worlds worst CSS programm, hacks are very usefull and cool =P</p>
]]></content:encoded>
				</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: DeeDee</title>
		<link>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-122060</link>
		<author>DeeDee</author>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Oct 2007 13:47:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://fadtastic.net/2007/05/28/css-hacks-are-they-cool-or-not/#comment-122060</guid>
					<description>I would love to not have to use hacks, but it's apparent that it's just a way of life right now.&#160; Until browsers start rendering CSS/XHTML in a consistent manner there will always be &#34;hacks&#34;.&#160; Personally, hacks feel like bandaiding the real problem of inconsistent browser standards and I loathe what I call &#34;patchwork coding&#34;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would love to not have to use hacks, but it&#8217;s apparent that it&#8217;s just a way of life right now.&nbsp; Until browsers start rendering CSS/XHTML in a consistent manner there will always be &quot;hacks&quot;.&nbsp; Personally, hacks feel like bandaiding the real problem of inconsistent browser standards and I loathe what I call &quot;patchwork coding&quot;.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
				</item>
</channel>
</rss>
